What They Are Saying . . .
About This Site, The 60s, The Counterculture, Their Lives Today
The Zonyx Report covers a variety of overlapping topics, many of them having a common connection with events & people of Milwaukee, especially the East Side, beginning with the Counterculture of the '60s. Since it began appearing in February 2000, I have received many e-mailed comments, from participants & observers, some of whom have moved far away or otherwise lost touch with each other. In reprinting them here I hope to help those who wish to get in contact with each other again, perhaps regaining a virtual community that once actually existed, or at least bring interested viewers up to date on some now-distant lives. At any rate, it is a forum for any criticism of my site anyone cares to offer -- some of which I may act upon -- as well as for some welcome compliments, which in either case I hope will stimulate others to follow suit.
|Comments:||Who They Are [See End for Index]:|
I read your site with a lot of interest. Not everyone stayed in Milwaukee, naturally. My take on what happened shifts in interesting ways when I read your work; I was a shadow on the "other side" of the K'scope effort. But, I remember vividly working alongside Gene Caldwell on the layout of Vol I, No 1. The East Side will always be a defining time/place as far as I am concerned. My part was conditioned by my student/factory worker/K'scope activities. Here in Winston-Salem NC last week, the first lunch counter sit-in was commemorated; not many younger people showed up. A lot of the struggle has been lost, and sometime soon a new one will be necessary. As a historian, it makes me sad, and cautious, in my own work with reconstructing the past.
Keep on with the site!
Harry Titus <email@example.com>
Comments Date: Mon. 28 Feb 2000
Subject: K'scope, etc.
Art Critic, Art Editor, etc.,
I've been gradually reading the stuff on your site and enjoying it immensely! I appreciate the wide range of material, the memory for details (as in the longshoreman story), the historical perspective (as in just about everything).
I agree that the sexism you display in the coffee house article is about as tame as it gets. If a singer is outstandingly attractive it would be impossible not to notice.
If you are writing a review there would be no reason not to mention it especially in the entertainment field. I guess back in those days (the publication date is not mentioned, is it?) people were not so conscious of "packaging a product in the music industry." Today we're more conscious of the package than the music.
There's a lot there (in your site) and I hope to gradually get through it all. But, then, I don't know how fast you're adding to it! I already spend hours and hours in front of my computer screen.
I began with computers only two years ago
and when I lost my job of 10 years as Activity Therapist at a chemical dependency treatment center --
they closed down -- an opportunity arose to return to
school. I chose a two year course toward a Master of Science
degree at Cardinal Stritch
University in Computer Science
Education and in two more months I'll be through. I started
from scratch and have learned a lot. I hope it's enough to
get a good job so I can soon begin saving for retirement now
that I'm old enough to retire!
. . . Just started a new job this week as »»
"Internet Content Developer" for Trisept Solutions, a sister company of The Mark Travel Corp. We mainly build sites for the travel industry.
I'm also developing a few sites on my own including http://www.woodlandpattern.org/
Mon, 13 Mar 2000
From: Rick Ollman
musician & poet
[New, from Teri
like it ! To say that you've put some work in this, is an
understatement. I'm impressed. I have to be honest...I just
did a quick browse - hopefully, one of these days, I'll have
the time to really do some reading. I've had little or no
time these last several months.
feel free to ask for the use of my small collection of Bugles and K'scopes and Brady St. posters if
ever you feel the need. I have a digital camera (a Sony
Mavica....it uses floppies, unlike the others that have to
be downloaded) so I could shoot the posters for you and just
give you the disk.
To: "Mike Zetteler" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Subject: The new look
Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2000
[New, from Diane M. Rey]
Hi Mike...Nice job
on the page. Did you realize that your recorded message does
not work? [Since corrected --M.Z.] I looked at
your source code and all I can see that might be wrong is
that you have it in an F:/ file. Is that a file on YOUR
computer or on execpc.com's? If it's on your hard drive, you
would be the only one able to hear it. Anyway...way to
go!!!! Nice pages and looking forward to seeing the rest of
them. My new email is Diane@jesstar.com
please include me when you send out news of updates. Jess gave me the
address this time and I figured you may have used the one
that was on my card and I don't use it anymore. So, there
you have it. Keep up the good work!! Diane
Diane M. Rey
Instant Messenger Name:
Web site designer
To: Mike Z.
From: Phil Wroblewski »»
Good to see your site up & running. It's sunny (mostly) & quiet here in So. Cal. where I'm living the single life & working as a clinical psychologist. I hope to get back to Milwaukee for a visit someday. . . .
[see below for another message --Mike Z.]
Date: Tue, 27 Jun 2006
howdaf__kareya? This is a letter I wrote to George [Johnson], threatening to call him Georgie. You can use it in your history (as in whateverhappenedto?) … add it to my history.
To: 'George johnson'
Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2006
Former UWM student & East Sider
A professional who made it out of Milw.
Nice enough guy, but now a boring
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Hi Mike -
Quite nice to hear from you. Would have responded much sooner but we've all been really sick around here for two weeks. But it's Monday morning and everyone is back at school and work and life is good again. This will have to be short because I'm back in my (home) office with piles of stuff to do.
Your web site looks great. I can appreciate the effort you've been putting into it (I've been learning how to do it too, so I can set up 3 sites for HB - my business). I'm nowhere near as good as you yet.
I think it only fitting and proper if you become the historic documentarian of Milwaukee's counter culture. Very cool idea - I hope you keep expanding it.
I heard about Priscilla, what did she die of? Sorry about your Mom, she was always very generous to me. Tell me about Kathy! What's she doin?
I didn't know you had seen Jon. He and Lisa, his fiancé, live above the Up and Under on Brady - really nice place. I'd love to tell you more about life in Marcialand and I will very soon. But for now I just wanted to acknowledge that I have seen your site and am enjoying it very much.
Give me your address - I have a pin I want to send you.
Take care of yourself,
[Message 2 from Marcia Drouin Smith] »»
Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000
From: The Smith Family
To: Mike Zetteler <email@example.com>
Subject: hey you
Marcia (Drouin) Smith
[Message 2 from Marcia]
Date: Tue, 16
E-Mail for Clubhouse. »»
This is the first time that I'm mentioned anywhere in the history of Milwaukee's Counterculture. I know that I was there until August of 1966, very active in the anti-war movement (or did I hallucinate all that?). Trouble is, that I wrote no poetry and most of the history starts in the late 60s when I was in Pittsburgh. We had some "hairy" times there too. When MLK was assassinated, there was a rally at a black church at the edge of "The Hill" (Pittsburgh is a city of hills, and they tend to be ethnic ghettos and "The Hill" is one of the Black Hills) overlooking Three Rivers Stadium.
First there was an attempt to assassinate the minister holding the rally. At the same time we could look up the street, into the ghetto and see half the street burning. If we looked the other way, toward Three Rivers Stadium, we could see tanks (yes real tanks) coming up the freeway ramps and into the ghetto. No wonder, that I thought that America would not survive the war with itself. A months after that, an old friend from Milwaukee, Milt Bratz (do you remember him? probably not) started graduate school at Pitt. I scared him and his wife off by talking about the need for armed revolution and exhorting him to get guns.
Well it was his fault -- he should not have tried a surprise visit on the afternoon that I was whacked on psilocybin. A few days later, I apologized but the damage was done. His wife thought I was nuts (and rude).
I like the website. Good to see those photos that Ralph took. The versions that he sent me were so huge that I couldn't see them all at once. They are nice and it's sad that all that stuff was burned out and even worse if it was deliberate arson. Hope you are well and that your teeth are no longer throbbing with pain.
Take care, Matt
[Message 2 from Matt Wilensky, Fwd from Ralph Larsen]
...and how come you're not working today [Ralph]. I assume this is your home. I hope you are well and not laid up with something debilitating. God! Ralph Larsen! (hisownbadself). Remember the Hate Society? The Shaving Cream birthday party we held for you (and everyone else who could drink themselves into a coma). No more comas for me because I tend to have blackouts and do embarrassing things. Even when I drink moderately, I tend to drop things (like a wine bottle all over the dinner table) and have miserable hangovers the next few days (days! sic!). I'm 60 years old and my body can't take it anymore. Hasn't been able to for 10 years now. I live in Escondido, Ca. This is a little town, just 25 miles north of San Diego. Am a Clinical Psychologist, working a lot with domestically violent men; otherwise I do as little as possible. At the last thing, I'm a success; but it doesn't pay very well. Comes the "Revolution" and I'll get paid for sitting around (or even laying around) and thinking. It's my right, written into the Constitution: "Life, Liberty, and the Purfuit of Happineff." I was married once, (no children), and that was enough. I'm just not made for marriage. I almost never let my defenses down and just can't do that intimacy thing that women need. I became a psychologist so that I could understand things like that; and I do understand, but that doesn't mean that I can do it on a sustained basis. So I married a woman who was as damaged as me, and it was a friggin' disaster. The stress was so bad, I got into heavy drugs (massive amounts of speed to keep my spirits (and my dick) up). Speed gives you the "dickofdeath" you know. These days, I'm very mellow (age helps) . [Everything else], I notice, gives me a slight "fuzzy" feeling for a day or so afterwards. I've become a Libertarian/Fiscal Conservative/Republican. A supporter of John McCain and even a closet Allan Keyes enthusiast. How's that for change???? In 1992, I voted for Clinton. After watching him for 2 years, I began to metamorphosize and now, I think, I'm a butterfly. Mike Z. doesn't like it and neither does my brother Steve. But I'm a recovering Socialist and it works for me, one day at a time. CASE IN POINT: I was watching C-SPAN this morning and some political columnist from, I think the Atlanta Constitution was being interviewed. They asked him about the Confederate flag issue. He said that the previous governor tried to change the flying of this flag and lost a lot of political support. Then he said something which astounded me. Amazed me! He said that as the controversy went on, the polls showed that a majority of black people were against the removal of the Confederate flag!!!!!!!!!!! So, what in the world, is all of this Liberal brouhaha about the flag (sic?) all about????? You don't think that the Liberals are using red herrings and demagoguery (sic?) do you? Perhaps they are. Many black Republicans that I listen to, often observe that the Democrats play the race card to the detriment of our society.
Something to think about.
From: Matt Wilensky, Ph.D.
Reply-To: m firstname.lastname@example.org
Milwaukeean & UWM Psychology student
[Message 2 from Matt]
thanks for the update...I'm just back from N. Ontario, hanging w/ Jeff Hinich, & we touched now & then on the old days...actually we had a rerun of sorts recently, w/ a bag ship in port, as you probably heard...I thought I e-mailed my congratulations & thanks quite some time ago, when I initially found out about your site...I enjoyed looking around.....be nice to see you one of these days....
Tue, 29 Aug 2000
From: Harvey Taylor
To: Mike Zetteler <email@example.com>
Subject: Re: Mike Zetteler's Site
Jeanne (Scheeler )]
Date: Tue, 11 Jul 2000
Milwaukeean & UWM student
MIKEL: In fact, I don't find the naked
dancers described on the Ozaukee Press page to be
"risible." In fact, just the opposite. See usage
note in Webster, 9th ed., at the "risibility"
entry: "'Our risibilities support us as we skim over
the surface of a deep issue'
. . . .The following extracts from Catherine
MacKinnon's *Toward a Feminist Theory of the State*
(Harvard University Press, 1989) may clarify for you the
difference between "prudery" and a feminist
interpretation of pornography. Following that are some
extracts from the Marxist art critic John
Berger's book *Another Way of Seeing* and additional
extracts from a filmmaker, a poet, and a revolutionary
philosopher, to perhaps help you to no longer confound the
Counter Culture's progressive critique of modern American
society with what you call "the age of topless and
. . . .[It's not by accident, Mikel, that you so carefully represent yourself as the *viewer* of the naked dancer in Ozaukee County. Read your "report" and you will see the effort you make to position yourself this way. You want to be, and you try to make yourself, the arbiter of everything you "report" on in this article, including the view the reader should take away concerning who's entitled to what views on others: i.e., the customer willing to pay his way to watch the girl undress. But the article really wasn't about legal issues, or the rights of paying customers, or the way men get off on treating women like objects, or what you seem to see as pornography's contribution to the more libertine, self-indulgent aspects of the "counter culture." It was all about you and the sense of power you derived from looking at her nude, from writing about yourself looking at her nude, and from even getting to be the acting page editor or whatever in laying out the article. You just want to lay out the world from your own point of view, with yourself as supreme Subject. You should read some feminist writing and some existentialist philosophy too.--jm]. . . .
[Message 2 From Jeanne]
. . . .and 2) the consistent male
chauvinist tone and male chauvinist practices of most
of your website's references
to women. I really wanted to examine the latter issue in
detail. Perhaps my e-mail seemed to be an excessive
response, but I was using some of your gender/image usages
as a text from which to explore, with just a small portion
of MacKinnon's argument,
the issues of gender, pornography, and
[Message 3 From Jeanne]
. . . .Perhaps the sexism expressed in some items on your website is less than blatant, Mikel. Perhaps my sensitivity and reactions to it are more pronounced because I directed a conference and edited a volume of papers a decade or so ago on the gender and representation issues raised by Berger, feminist film theorists, and others concerned with this problem. . . .
. . . .And perhaps what you see as my extreme reactions to sexism on your website partake of my being very put-out by your frequent disparaging references to my use of [a prescribed medication] and what you think of as its dehumanizing effects. . . .
[Message 4 From Jeanne]
. . . .ACTUALLY, ALMOST EVERY REFERENCE YOU MAKE TO WOMEN, EITHER ON THE WEBSITE OR IN CORRESPONDENCE, REPRESENTS THEM AS "NAKED" (REMEMBER THE STUFF YOU WROTE ABOUT PUTTING UP ON YOUR SITE NUDE PICTURES OF YOUR GIRLFRIENDS?) AND SEXUAL, AND NOTHING ELSE. REMEMBER THE 'NAKED HIPPIE CHICKS' IN YOUR 'HISTORY OF THE EAST SIDE,' REPRESENTED AS GETTING IT ON IN THE OFFICES OF SUBCULTURE NEWSPAPERS? AND THE NAKED DANCER, AND THE FOLKSINGER THAT YOU HAD TO DESCRIBE IN TERMS OF HER PHYSICAL ATTRACTIVENESS EVEN THOUGH YOUR COLLEAGUES ON THE NEWSPAPER DISAPPROVED OF NEEDLESS REFERENCES TO THE PHYSICAL APPEARANCE OF WOMEN IN COPY?. . . .
. . . .I STAND BY MY READING OF YOUR REVIEW AND THE AFTERMATH AT THE PAPER, IN WHICH YOU WERE ASKED TO REMOVE THE REFERENCES TO THE SINGER'S PHYSICAL QUALITIES BEFORE YOUR COLLEAGUES WOULD AGREE TO PUBLISH THE REVIEW. WHY COULDN'T YOU DO THIS? WHAT POINT WERE *YOU* TRYING TO MAKE?. . . .
Fri, 29 Sep 2000
From: jeanne [deleted]
To: Mike Zetteler
Subject: Re: Updated Web Site
[Message 2 From Jeanne]
Mon, 9 Oct 2000
[Message 3 From Jeanne]
[Message 4 From Jeanne]
a bit of time to read more of your culture
recollection of getting high blew me back in time -- seems
as though you have added more since I first looked at it --
[New Message from George]
. . . . Don Rubin was the other person shot in the back, but unlike [Randy] Anderson, he lived. I met him when I was a student at MATC -- a very quiet person, he would not talk about that night until almost a year had gone by and we had become somewhat of friends. From what I remember, he believes it was in large part a police set up-- with Schmidt the one pushing for the fire bombing, which I believe was suspected at the time. Rubin kept a low profile because he and his family sought and won a pardon from the Governor. Don eventually settled on the West Bank with his wife( not a Jew) and that is the last I have heard from him. Still I think his story could fill in some details about the YIP commune-
From: "George r.
Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2002
Subject: randy anderson
UWM graduate, former POST editor
|[New, from D.J. Zetteler, The Netherlands] »»||
Reply-To: "DJ" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
From: "DJ" <email@example.com>
Subject: nice family site
Date: Wed, 14 Aug 2002
[New, from Ralph Larsen]
wanted to make some comments about your web site, but I just
haven't had the time. I do have some news for you, I
ran into George Johnson last week.
I saw him in Madison while walking down the
street. He looks great and seems to be successful. He
has an interesting tail to tell- but I'll let him tell it.
His email address is: firstname.lastname@example.org
From: "Ralph Larsen" <email@example.com>
Subject: George Johnson
Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2001
Please think of this as a thank you note. I
discovered your website, not while
searching for Zetteler, that
would have been too easy. I was getting creative and
looking for de Bourghelles and found
[New Message from Cynthia]
. . . .Yes, I write travel mostly
and the site I write for at the moment is www.igougo.com and I write under the guide name Peregrine. I've
just posted text and pictures about the Open Space in Albuquerque, where
I spent a lot of free time and Chuck
(husband) gives walking tours,
or did, I think he's moved on to running conservation
organizations at the moment. Ah, to be retired and do
whatever you damn please.
Subject: Zetteler Genealogy
Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001
What a nice surprise. I was just beginning to think
that you just weren't interested in family
history. The two of my sisters who are living
down here aren't.
Date: Sat, 13 Apr 2002
Subject: Branch of family tree
[New, from Cynthia d'Este (Coffin)]
Excellent web site. Will take me a while to
scrutinize. . . .
[More from Cynthia] »»
. . .
describing my past 30 years. They've
Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002
Subject: Excellent web site!
student & East Side dweller &
[New, from Barbara Gibson] »»
sent me your website, which
she had gotten from Rose Rinder,
I think. My God, Mike,
you've done a massive job of reporting the history of
that place, those times! It's really incredible,
and I hope people appreciate it. I do, though
it's a little overwhelming, for one thing, and I'm not
sure I want to remember all that, for another.
Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002
Former UWM English instructor, poet,
feminist, writer, Earth Mother/sensualist,
civil rights crusader; Marxist-Humanist champion of the working class; war protestor; role model & friend to many
students, artists, activists, beatniks, hippies, Yippies & other folks. Mother of Julia & Lucy.
It's me, Morgan!
I have just seen you, heard you, read your lively words about Milwaukee in the 1960s -- sent to me by daughter Julia in Hollywood, who received it from her friend Rose Rinder in Milwaukee. You can proudly say like Ishmael (the one in MOBY DICK), "I alone have survived to tell the tale!" (Is that what he said?) I plunged right into your sea of countercultural nostalgia, just about drowning. I clicked on links right and left, reading most of the night, over my head, till I collapsed in bed, and this morning decided instead of trying to read everything at one sitting I will savor those adventures a little at a time, a day at a time, with your voice echoing in every word.
How did you do all this? Your work is remarkable, and not just because of of its many tickets for ego-trips, but because you have invented a new Milwaukee art form for a unique and fascinating chunk of its history -- one of the most innovative websites that I've encountered. I'm interested in your family record also. What next?
To bring you up to date:
For 24 years I've been married to Keiko Matsui Gibson (whom you met when we gave that poetry reading at UWM), who teaches modern literature, gender studies, and cross-cultural subjects. That's longer than I was married to Barbara. We have a 16 year old son Christopher Gibson (aka Matsui So) who is in 10th grade at Yokohama International School. He's bilingual, excels at playing the cello (at it for more than ten years), loves studying Japanese and western history (having just written a paper on Chinese revolutionary history), writes occasional poetry and fiction for the school's literary magazine and articles for the school newspaper, also interested in math and the sciences, discusses politics and other news with me, rebels against me but is polite to others.
I teach at two Japanese universities and for three years have been writing PHILOSOPHIZING IN THE VOID, a column in most issues of KYOTO JOURNAL (but will henceforth instead contribute separate articles and reviews as contributing editor). I'll e-mail you later some writings that I've got in my iBook. Meanwhile, you can find some of my work and Keiko's online:
My Revolutionary Rexroth: Poet of East-West Wisdom (a book that was originally published and won a Choice Award) is at
(webmaster is Karl Young from Milwaukee, living in Kenosha); and Karl's Light & Dust Portable Anthology of Poetry: Morgan’s One Looks at One is at <www.thing.net/~grist/lnd/mgibson.htm>
and Keiko's How Do You Like America and Other Poems is at
Some of our poems are also in The Plaza:
Family news: After counseling students at Evergreen College for many years, Barbara continues to live in Olympia, Washington, and writes plays about the goddess Sophia.
After being a special effects producer for 15 years or so, Julia continues to live in Hollywood with TV producer Aaron Lipstadt and their teenage son Isaak, with her daughter Miranda (born in the Milwaukee Yippie Commune) and HER son Charlie living nearby.
Lucy is a computer scientist working on artificial intelligence for Ray Kurzweil (said to be the greatest inventor since Edison) in Boston.
I was sad to hear of the death of Ed Burton. How are his wife, daughter, and others in his family? I asked Vicki (in a letter after his death) what might become of all of their publications, might a university library become their home, etc., but have not received a reply. Are there any 60's archives at UW-Milwaukee or UW-Madison for collections such as yours, Ed's, Karl Young's, etc.? What are plans for your own collection in the future? I've been wondering what to do with what's left of my poetry collection and correspondence with many poets, which are housed in Michigan.
Have you recently been in touch with Karl or Antler and Jeff Poniewaz or others I might know in Milwaukee?
I'd love to hear from you and will offer you any information I can about those exciting years in Milwaukee. You have certainly done a conscientious, exciting, and imaginative job! I wish we could meet.
Date: Thu, 10
Subject: Let there be commerce
From: Morgan Gibson <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Former UWM English professor (Literature, Creative Writing); poet & writer of fiction; ascetic experimenter & orientalist; radical thinker; civil rights & anti-war activist & community gadfly (with ex-wife Barbara); both hospitable East Siders & mentors until losing tenure or jobs over Vietnam War protests.
We live at 3-17-604 Sakashita-cho, Isogo-ku, Yokohama-shi 235-0003 Japan. Our telephone/fax number is (045) 761-9223. (From North America dial 011-81-45-761-9223).
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Yes, it is I, Cathy Gubin who worked on the Bugle in Milw. with Marty Racine. I have lived in France for the last 18 years. I am an International Editor for a top five IT Consulting firm. Marty Racine works for the Houston Chronicle.
I don't have the time right now to look into your site, but can do that later in January.
7 Jan 2003
Subject: Re: Bugle-American,
Milwaukee, the past
From: "Cathy Gubin"
Former East Sider & Bugle-American
Staff Photographer & Layout Artist
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|[Your Comments Here!]||
[your name here!]
Contributors, A -- L:
Coffin, Cynthia [Cynthia d'Este]
Drouin, Marcia [Marcia Smith]
d'Este, Cynthia [Cynthia Coffin]
Gibson, Barbara [Barbara O'Mary]
Gruver, Cynthia [Zetteler Genealogy]
Johnson, George R.
Lewis, Judy [Zetteler Genealogy]
of Contributors, M -- Z:
Rey, Diane M.
Smith, Marcia [Marcia Drouin]
Wilensky, Matt [See also Phil Wroblewski below]
Wroblewski, Phil [See above]
Zetteler, D. J. [Zetteler Genealogy]
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